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In Discussion with NDTCO

By June 10, 2022July 7th, 2022No Comments

A Webinar with JUSTLY CEO Paul Karrlsson-Willis

On a webinar with NDTCO, JUSTLY CEO Paul Karrlsson-Willis discusses how you can be a part of the growing demand for socially conscious business and use a self-directed account for ESG investments.

Video Transcript

well hello and welcome my name is chris tanner i’m a director of education here at new direction trust company and uh

we’re excited uh we have a new and unique topic for us today

where we’re going to be talking about esg investing and we have a special guest with us today from justly

who i’ll introduce here in just a moment you can probably see paul there on your screen but we had just a couple of

things i wanted to run through before i introduce paul and

with all webinars we have to begin with this disclaimer just letting you know that today’s

webinar is really intended for educational purposes just to be clear new direction trust

doesn’t offer any specific investments or investment advice nor do we endorse

any specific kind of investment or specific investments so today’s really just meant to be educational

and so if you do have questions and are interested in anything uh related to today’s webinar we certainly suggest

that you consult with uh you know or competent financial advisor or someone

that can help you make decisions uh within that space

and so with that being said i uh just also wanted to mention

that as an attendee uh we cannot hear you

but if you do have questions today on the right hand side of your screen

there’s just a little button there type your question in next to that i’ll

be able to see those i’ll read those questions out loud as we’re going along

most of those questions i think will be directed towards paul but we’ll read those out loud so

everybody can hear them but that’s how we’ll communicate today uh if you do have questions uh related

to uh today’s webinar so with that being said paul how are you today i am very good thank you very much for

having me today yeah so paul i thought it’d be wonderful if uh you could give

us just a little bit of background both on yourself but then also on justly and give us a little bit of a

feel for where you came from to get to this point and then uh also justly’s path and then

we’ll get into some more specifics about esg investing a little bit later on excellent excellent thank you yes so uh

i’ve been in the financial services business now for 39 years

studied in the uk and part of maggie’s army so way way back

margaret thatcher in government started a intern program at various

offices and companies as a way of subsidizing getting people jobs so i was lucky enough to get a job

out of broken either so i started as a and basically a paid government intern

at a broker dealer running around london uh delivering mao and from there i was able to work my way

up uh run various settlement groups set up various settlement groups um was shipped over to the us

uh about 25 years ago by fidelity who had been working for in the uk

setting up a global trading business and and settlement business for them in equities

um basically set up a three or four businesses for them out of boston

um and then moved on run various trading desks set up various trading desks

uh a lot of the stuff i’ve done has been setting up uh broker dealers new products

new technology um which is what brought me to justly um one of uh the senior management team

here at ideonomics capital asked me to to join and set up a broker

dealer that focuses on crowdfunding reg a and reg d so private

uh equity and debt business with uh with an eye on esg and i know

you and i are going to talk more about what psg truly is but it stands for environmental social and governance

um and we look at a lot of companies that focus on

that area or across all three which is which is getting harder and harder to do

currently but we are pretty new we’ve been going since august of last year

we have probably half a dozen deals now on our platform um and again a variety from cf a and d

i mean over the next couple of months that’ll probably triple uh to closer to 20.

yeah i know i appreciate that you may have to update your slide i think you’re closer to 40 years than

been 30 years but though i appreciate that and so

paul as we were talking just a little bit uh before we jumped on and went live here

the the types of offerings that you have are they’re private offerings right and

so you wanted to just briefly touch upon the idea of these private offerings and the what those look like for those that

are maybe relatively new to these types of offerings yeah it’s i

i think the keeping thing to remember is that when an issuer comes to

us and they’re looking to raise money there’s various forms as you touched on there so there’s reg d

which is normally more institutionalized it’s run by a broker dealer structured by a broker dealer

in most cases um and that can be of any size and certainly if you’re a foreign

entity a foreign company looking to raise in the us then red d is the way to go and the only

way to go um and then you have sierra from reggae now both of those uh are reasonably new

they come through from from the jobs act um and these can be used by again

various science companies the big difference between those two and right d

is that any retail investor or any investor can

invest in them whereas a reg d you have to be an accredited investor cf has restrictions in the sense that

you can only raise up to five million under a cf and then reggae you can raise up to 75

million so when you’re an issuer you’re going to look at these in in various ways

depending on why you need the money and the type of investor you’re going after

so if you’re a uh wine company for instance or if you’re a spirits company and you’re looking to

raise money a cf is actually quite a good idea because with that you’re looking at as

many retail investors as you can get to buy your product

right and if they invest in your company if you can get a thousand people to invest in your company the chances are

you’ve got a thousand people who are going to go out there and buy your wine or buy your bokeh

other companies will want to do a reg a because they are looking to raise more

money and secondly they may want to put a higher limit on it threshold of an

investor getting in so that they can manage their cap table and the cap table

is basically all the investors that they have in those companies so

again that’s how these these issuers are looking at it they’re looking at their product who they want to hear

who will be interested in them and the best way of

doing the various stages of growth some will do cf to start with we’re automatically working on a reg a

some will do a cf and have it basically a private placement d going on in the background where they’re

going to friends and family or institutional investors that they know and the other the other thing to

to keep in mind there is this feeling with cfs that they’re really truly retail they’re

really small companies they’re seedlings that is not always the case sometimes

you will get companies that already have revenue they’re already have various contracts and and doing

well in the business and this is just another way of them bringing in a small amount of money to meet either

again getting a different client base involved or just to give them a bridge to the next race so

as i say you shouldn’t be confused that cf is always the small little company

looking for money sometimes there are some good companies in there that have some sort of good background and a

revenue stream already yeah paul appreciate that and

i know you have more information just good educational information on your website just kind of

differentiating because we’re going to get into some of this and and how you’re picking

what to put on your platform so to speak but just wanted to mention that and so we’re going to kind of zip through

some of the next few slides because we wanted to really get into the meat and potatoes so to speak and and talk about

justly about esg and you know i think what a lot of people are most interested in but if if

you do have just questions about the different ways that people are raising capital i would encourage you to visit

the justly website and i know you’ve got some good education there uh to help help people kind of sort through that

yeah the website’s invest and it does have uh frequently asked

questions and answers there which covers uh a lot of that information we also have a lot of

information um that is links to the sec and finra so you can get detailed

information around the rules and breaks of all of these types of deals and we also have give people the ability to

email us from that website um so if they have any questions we’ll be very happy

to answer them yeah and i kind of wanted to start off paul

by asking uh you know i get the basic idea of of

justly but if you could kind of put that in a package for us you know what what is it that you’re

doing i know you’re taking your experience your team’s experience and you’re basically going out looking

for opportunities give us kind of the big picture of what justly is providing

what your services are yes so basically we have two sets of clients we have issuers so companies

looking to raise money and then we have investors so on the issuer side uh we’ve

teamed up with various other broker dealers we’ve teamed up

with companies that our incubators

to various asg companies and esg as we said is environmental

social and corporate governance so this can be something that is an ev company

which we actually have one right now uh on our on our website um to power charging um it could be

better ways of farming so we we look at those sort of

companies to give them um access to our our investor client base the other thing

we also do is we do have deals on the platform that uh won’t necessarily fall under esg and

so with those we actually get 20 of our profit on that bill to a non-profit

that is making an impact in esg so what we really want to do is any of the

investors coming in and investing will be making an impact either by the company that

they’re purchasing or buying into as well as as the charity donation

wise we have the full gamut on investors so we have traditional retail investor

we have the accredited investors and then we have the institutional investors so we deal with family offices wealth

managers vcs uh even depending on the size of the deal on our regular site we may even be

speaking to blackrock and showing in those bills to to those companies so on the investor

size we we have the complete range and the idea is to match the investor with a

good opportunity there is no guarantees in this business and i think you had the disclaimer at the very beginning um

there really isn’t there’s there’s no guarantees in private equity there’s no guarantees in in any investment even

from the stock market so um what we try and do is filter that a little bit to

um make sure the clients or the companies come into the platform have been truly

looked at so we do a lot of dd we prop we do do more dd uh due diligence than

uh we need to when it comes to cf and reggae um we really kind of try and make sure that

we keep the ties as much as possible to make sure that the company

has a chance has a good business model has a good leadership um again no guarantees

after that but we do feel like we’re putting in the work beforehand to make

sure that any investor coming to our platform knows we put the work in and a lot of that information will be made

available to the investors so they’ll see the data rooms and and so forth around these companies so they get a

really good feel for who they are so maybe to put a kind of a bow on that

if somebody’s interested you know they want to get into the environmental social and in this this area or arena

you’re you’re kind of helping get those initial steps the initial evaluations

to kind of get people to a point where maybe they feel a little more comfortable uh number one the the investment

category but number two you’ve actually walked through and done a certain level of due diligence and i

was wondering if you could maybe go just a tiny bit deeper because as truly someone new to this just

speaking for myself there’s probably always that concern right that i’d love to invest in things

that are environmentally socially responsible but not a not at the risk of not getting a

return on my investment right there’s this balancing act and i thought maybe you could

address that a little bit because i think there’s probably a way to achieve both if there is and again if you look at

various reports out there that um they will say that

companies that follow an esg or an impact model uh knocked me out performed by five to

seven percent um again this data is new um and i think

you know when we first started justly esg was that key thing

and the more and more we’ve looked at this space where we’ve really moved now more into

impact investing and impact investing is esg except there’s data attached to it

and therefore um if you look at companies like as you sow just capital for instance two

non-profits they’re very very good at capturing data and

uh evaluating companies on their uh esg on the impact

that they’re making and they do that for all listed companies it’s harder to do in a private um equity side because the

data’s not always there and the companies are not always so

sophisticated um but we’ve teamed up with a company called proof of impact and proof of impact uh are separate from

us completely different organization but we do introduce our issuers to them and

they will go through a bunch of questionnaires around what they do re

waste what their how they pay their employees how the government governance of the company is done and they will get

a ranking so it is done on data points and that’s becoming more and more

important in this in the esja esg and the impact spaces what data do

we have how do we prove a company is truly doing what they say and how they

do it so if you look at someone like um tesla for instance just got moved out of

one of the largest esg uh 100s um which would shock everybody because

most people think tesla is esg it is eb but they got moved out because of

various problems or things that won’t be resolved inside the company um you have other companies coming out

with etfs saying that there is etfs but when these independents come in

and actually look at it they find that maybe only 20 of the company or the companies are

actually esg so the data is now coming in and you’re now getting more and more groups looking

at this data no one’s confirmed what data is going to be standardized there’s still a lot of different opinions on

what that looks like but data is coming in now and data is being looked at and

so we we’ve started in that direction too uh we’re going through a process right now uh with proof of impact we’re

also going through a process with blab which is another non-profit that gives

uh big coup certificates to companies they rank as esg so we’re going through that process

right now but it’s all about data now there is an updater out there for people to see

what’s happening and how it’s happening and is a company truly walking the talk

rather than just talking about being making an impact or being sg

no that makes sense and i think you and you might be able to tie this into the growth of esg but it feels like

this is a newer area and so the means to measure it

and the ways that we identify the companies and then like you said are they walking the walk

we’re developing new ways of actually evaluating that and so it looks like you you got your hands on some good

independent third-party companies there so question for you

maybe a tiny bit of history because i know that the environmental social concepts

been around for a little while but give us a feel when it comes to the growth

uh like how is there a sense of how people are moving that way

as opposed to more traditional investing do you have a feel for that

yes so again there’s there’s various stats and it depends on on which country

you’re talking about or which continent you’re talking about um you know europe is way ahead uh in a

lot of things that it’s doing um in the esg space as a whole a lot of that has been pushed by

government um so the likes of norway were way ahead way ahead of most

countries um you know they were looking at this you know 15 20 years ago

uh and putting in to make sure that boards were um

had had as many women as men on the board and they brought that in as a war

um and so i think you know we’ve seen investing going in the esg spaces

doubled tripled quadrupled every year it’s just

been moving and moving forward and and now the key element to it is over the last four or five years

there has been this push to the data route right um and and the questions being asked yes

we believe it’s the right thing to do yes we believe that we should be trying to find other ways

of looking after the environment or or being more minorities uh in the workplace or

at senior levels we believe a lot of this stuff um we want companies to do it

um but where’s the data right so it was very easy as i say for people to say it

which we just touched on now that data element is kicking in and i think once we truly capture that data

and and get more of a standardized you will see this become one of the key

things that people look at it’s important now but it’s still only important to

probably 10 of investors but it’s getting bigger and bigger and

bigger and i think um the data is the data element has been the area that’s

kind of held it back a little bit because there is that lack of trust or lack of transparency on

what truly is going on yeah i know i i appreciate that it

definitely feels like to your point it’s a trend and to the point where it’s

growing growing growing and it’s you know it it’s here to stay you know this is that

a wave and then it’s going to go away yeah it’s it’s definitely here to stay in and and again you’re always worried

right and certainly in the financial services business you know there’s always buzzwords there’s always things people get excited

about and then they they fade away right stacks everyone was excited about it you

don’t really hear too much about them now right um so etfs they come about and they stay

right so you do get these certain elements coming in that stay and some that come in for you know two or three

years and and then disappear esg there was a worry about that i think at the very beginning um is okay is this

just a new trend is this just a new way of selling mutual funds is this new way of selling etfs um

the answer is no that’s not the case this has become something that a lot of people are looking at a lot of people

are taking it seriously and as i say that data element is going to be the next real step as soon as that’s in

there then i think you know it’s going to be one of the main things that people look at as far

as companies and investment companies yeah no i appreciate that and

it’s a question and i hope to give you a chance to shine here but if this is

as me as an investor this is important to me and i i this is where i want to place my money

you know obviously i can just click a button and find an etf but why would i visit

with justly you know what what’s the difference you know i could just click a button invest in an etf and i’m investing in

environmentally socially responsible companies i hope i hope they’ve maybe not you kind of said that maybe

that’s the case but what’s justly doing that’s different or maybe above and beyond me just going

to an great etf i wish you given me that before i come

on um so i think uh with the etf stuff uh it’s a great diversity etfs are good for

diversification right you go in you’re not really sure of particular names or companies that

you want but you do want to be in a certain sector in this case esg

so if you’re doing that and it’s a sensible thing to do then i would just make sure that you check out uh as you

sow or just capital and see what they think of the best etfs in that space we

don’t compete there um but that would be what you would need to do you need to do your research and

there are companies out there that can give you that what justly is doing is there is

a lot of uh platforms out there we funder and so forth that have private equity on

um and that’s where we sit and what we’ve done is we’re doing the extra research around

esg right we’re an impact investing we’re looking at these issuers putting them with

proof of impact enabling the investor to have more

transparency into who these companies are and are they are they truly doing a good

thing because one of the the elements with es uh esg

is that you can be really really good on the east side but if you’re not treating

your staff very well and your employees well and you’re underpaying them and you have no governance

you will not get a high score when it comes to impact investing because there

are elements that are negative or you’re weak on and we via poi plan to be able

to show that so when an investor comes in they can see what the issue is strength is as far as

e as far as s as far as g is concerned so we’re going to give the investor who

is looking at private equity opportunities the ability to get more detail and more

transparency around esg impact

companies yeah that makes sense and let’s talk a little bit about

more of the individual investor because my guess is is that on our webinar that’s mostly who we’re talking about

so if somebody’s a little bit new and they’re coming to visit you tell help me understand that journey for somebody

who’s interested in investing and what that might look like for the individual yes certainly um

so personally uh the website’s invest so you can come to that website that

website will have our bills on it so as soon as you go to the landing page first page it has various companies

that um you can potentially invest in um they will be uh their tombstones so basically

what that means is it will give you a little outline of who the company is uh how much they’re looking to raise but

also mention if you needed to be an accredited investor or not um so some of our deals are just for

incred accredited investors um and and as i say somewhere retail

some of them uh will also have limits of uh what the minimum investment is and

again it will will tell you uh there uh on that side and then if there’s a deal you want to

find more information about you would just click click click on that deal and then you will be able to then look up

more information around exactly what that offering is who that that company is

um and then if you want to invest um certainly if it’s a cf deal you would just click invest it will ask you to

sign up and it will take various pieces of your information um it would also ask you know you can

pay by credit card pch and wire so you would need those instructions too so we’ll ask you all

those details um if you’re an accredited investor it would ask you those details and more

to prove that the investor is accredited but it can all be done very

smoothly through the website and again as i say via the website you are able to communicate with us as well

and we will get back to you with any questions on the answers that you need

yeah and then obviously we offer retirement plans and so i’m assuming

that you are able to work with people that want to utilize retirement funds yes

they would do the payment instructions would be it was coming out of out of your fund uh your ira

so that would be the uh instructions and then you would be able to

again invest straight out of out of that fund and so

i’m going to jump to that just piece just a little bit and then i want to come back and and i have another question for you

but for those of you that aren’t as familiar with using retirement

funds to invest in these private offerings just a couple quick things i wanted to make folks aware of

and one is is that there are a lot of different custodians that offer retirement plans

out there and if you’re interested in something like a private equity investment you

know maybe you’re interested in something with justly it’s just important that you’re using the right kind of ira and so you’ll hear

the term self self-directed ira out there and so self-directed isn’t a type of ira

but what’s important is is that it’s the kind of ira that allows you to invest in private offerings and so you would just

want to work with a custodian you know like new direction trust that offers the right type of retirement plan

and then as far as how the process works it’s really just three steps

one is setting up the right kind of an account which obviously you could do that with us and you so you’d set up

like a traditional or roth ira as an example and then of course we’ve got to get money into the account a lot of times

people are simply moving funds from another retirement plan or you can make a contribution

and then to paul’s point pretty straightforward you’re ready to acquire those assets and we work with

you alongside with the investment provider to just make sure that it’s titled in the ira

and that you get the correct tax treatment because obviously the retirement plan gets a different tax

treatment than you would individually and so we’ll work alongside folks to make sure that they’re able to do that

okay so paul i wanted to uh circle back before we get into the q a

and from just a broad question i guess you know tell us you

know why should people be concerned why should they even want to look at the environmentally socially you know

responsible companies uh you know why shouldn’t i just go out and make the most money i possibly can

you know give us that big picture well there’s as i say there are groups out there right now that uh would argue

if you look at the data that if you take esg companies that have taken esg on

board and run the companies uh to you know the various uh data

points their performance has been five to seven percent better um so there is data coming out now that performance

also goes with vsg i think the other aspect is technology um you’re seeing a lot of companies

coming out with new technology and that technology is again around esg

so if you’re looking for a company that may be

pushing the boundaries of what we know today as far as technology

then the chances are they’re going to be around the esg areas of various

businesses uh and industries um we see a lot of stuff that is you know

we still talk about coal and the need for coal and that’s not going to go away right it’s not going to go away tomorrow

it will go away hopefully but it’s not going to go away tomorrow so there is technology companies coming out saying

okay we’re going to have to keep using coal so how do we do it in a more efficient manner how do we do it with

less pollution how do we maximize every piece of coal

so that’s where the new technologies come from that’s not that’s not coming in coal that’s coming as an esg solution

so a lot of this stuff you’ll see coming in and that new tech is definitely um

something to keep an eye on and and as i say depending on why you’re investing in private equity right most people

investing in private equity for a couple of reasons one they’re looking for that new technology they’re looking for that

company that is going to grow um also something they believe in right

it’s a way of of investing in something for change or impact as as we said

um and then the the the other aspect of it is is to feel like you have skin in

the game um you know my wife’s invested in private equity and

and like i said earlier about a wine company or a vodka company she’s in a bourbon company and so every one of

christmas gets bourbon because it’s her bourbon company even though she owns 300 shares

right it’s that feeling that you’re part of that bill um part of that company is

very very important and then the other thing that’s come in recently and we’re

we’re very certainly me personally but the company as a whole are very focused on this

is hiring minorities and people with disabilities is something we’re focused on we’re working with the doug flutie

foundation and we sponsor their webinars which talk about people with autism and their role in

various jobs and their employers on how beneficial these these people have been we’re part

of the national down syndrome society c ceo committee

and they are looking again at how they get more and more people with disabilities into the workplace the

reason i mention that is people are now looking at

investing in companies that make an impact that they can see rather than

necessarily giving it to a charity so you imagine if you can invest in a private equity company that

whose mission is to hire people with different different abilities

by you investing in them you can see that they’ve taken their workforce from 10 people to 12 people

you’ve made that impact you can see that impact so you’re seeing seeing a certain

group of investors now looking at that way of investing where they can see

the impact that they want to make on something they personally feel strongly about

that’s an interesting point uh they hadn’t really thought of anything like that where you know could be a

charitable contribution or it’s an investment but something you firmly believe in that

totally makes sense well i did want to remind folks that if you have any questions

on your screen on the right-hand side there’s just a little tab there it’s a little triangle that says questions you

can just type your questions in i’ll read those questions out loud and we’ll go ahead and get those

answered for folks and uh had one question come in here and uh

also the question is let’s say you’ve you’ve got a company that meets uh all the guidelines for being an esg

uh now we flip to the financials the question’s kind of like how deep

are you digging into the financials do you have a threshold in other words that you’re going to put that company on the

platform or you’re not you know are you going to turn companies away if you’re concerned about the

financials but they look great on the esg side yes so that’s a great question

um so again we we will look at the esg site

but first and foremost as as i mentioned earlier we do uh

very thorough dd on all companies uh via cfa or rec d it doesn’t matter if

they’re esg or not esg um and the reason for being doing that is we do

we do want to give the issuer uh

the chance of of success and we also want to make sure that the investor

knows that we’ve done as much as we can as far as reviewing that business again

there’s no guarantees here but we do feel confident that

we’ve done as much as we possibly can to look at the financials the ownership

and and the projected business uh growth so we will look at all of that stuff um

a lot more than just the esg element because again you know we have a business to run we have a reputation um

and we want to be the best out there in this space and to do that um again it’s it’s that’s

balancing act of making sure we have issue of success which means investors

need to have a success too and if we put uh deals on our platform that are not very good

then that doesn’t do the investor any good it doesn’t do the issue or any good and it and it doesn’t do justly any good

so we we we do do a reasonably deep dive into into all the all companies not just

uh esg or obama every company guess we’ll tap the same way

oh i appreciate that so paul i’m not seeing any other questions at this

time but if you could remind us uh if somebody wanted to learn more uh what

was your website again invest okay and i love the name justly

you guys did a good job whoever you know when you were putting that together your marketing it’s that’s a great name for

the company thank you thank you that’s uh that goes to um

who is the ceo of ideonomics who is our parent company um who are listed

on nasdaq under idex um that was that was that was the one thing when i come in he

said he wasn’t going to change he goes i told you that’s it and you can do whatever else you want to

do with the broken dealer but you’re going to no the name fits yeah let him know a

great job that and that’s memorable i’ll i won’t forget it if that makes sense so

uh we did have another question come in uh the question is basically not sure if it was covered but

uh are there secondary trading systems on the platform if if a company goes

public or doesn’t go public like or is there liquidity in the investments

great question um and it sounds like uh the person who asked this question is

pretty up on the changes that have been coming in um so originally when you buy private

equity the situation used to be uh for youtube to get out

had to be they merged with someone or they did an ipo there are now ats’s alternate trading

systems out there there’s two or three out that do enable um

you to be able to offer or buy stock in a secondary market in in private equities

we as justly are looking at that we’re talking to a couple of people right now about teaming up uh in that

area with an ats we believe it is the next step um in the

growth of private equities especially as a lot of private equity companies now

are taking longer and longer to do the ipo and in some cases they feel they’re better off not doing an ipo

so if you as a private investor want to get out the ats will be one of the only ways out

unless you sell it back to the company so we are looking at the ats there are a couple out there

again as you can imagine these are very very new so the finra sec

are still looking at the guidelines the underlying companies the private equity

companies are still not sure if they want to be on the ats’s or not so again this

there’s still conversation around it they’re there not as big as one would like uh liquidity is certainly not there yet

but we do believe in 24 months that those marketplaces will be uh will

be friday and and will be a demarco yeah

well that makes sense and and you could always sell to a private individual as long as they meet the

accreditation status would they have to be approved like how would that work if just another private individual

it’s tough right firstly you’ve got to find them which probably means they’re friends or family

and then you would need to work through the transfer agent to get that done

um of the private equity company and they would normally bring in the

the underlying company as well to make sure that they’re okay but the most of that would have to be

done through a transfer agent because it would literally be a changing name all right

on the captive okay uh you mentioned uh

company before but could you elaborate what is the relationship between ideonomics and

justly so ideonomics is a as i say a holistic

company on nasdaq they have two parts of their business they have electronic vehicles

they have italian motorbikes they have tractors they have two or three different power solutions uh all in the

ev space um and so they started justly because they were seeing a lot of

companies private companies coming to them uh asking for ideonomics to buy

into and as you can imagine ideonomics can’t buy into everybody um so the idea was

hey let’s set up a broker dealer and we’ll help those companies uh find

investors so that was the idea behind it and and it’s working pretty well and and now

we’re actually seeing issuers finding justly before they find ideonomics and

therefore we actually introduce some of those companies to ideonomics if again it fits the ecosystem uh of

ideonomics and what they’re looking for so that’s how we that’s how we kind of

work with our parent company i appreciate that that makes sense

well paul i want to thank you for taking some time to

share the esg private opportunities that you’re providing at justly

uh any closing remarks anything you’d like to share as we close this out

yeah i mean i would just say if anyone has questions we mentioned the website as i say you know plug it again invest um this we we try and give everyone as much information as we can

if you follow us on social media you’ll also get good ideas of other things that are

happening so we talk about justly a little bit but a lot of stuff that we do on social media is more around different

elements that we’re seeing in the esg space that are being looked at new technology

how minority groups are doing well uh and so forth so it’s a good place if

you want to follow us to find out what’s going on in the esg space globally uh for

information i appreciate that well again thank you so much uh for taking

some time today uh to share that information uh i certainly learned some new things

and uh it was very informative and and if folks are interested in learning

about self-directed retirement plans uh we would encourage you to visit new direction trust company so just google

new direction trust and i’m sure you’ll be able to find us we’ll be happy to

help you with that as well so paul i hope you have a wonderful day thank you and thank you

it’s greatly appreciated yeah absolutely and thank you everyone in attendance and we hope to

interact with you sometime soon take care now thank you thanks